In lieu of life content, a comment

[goddessfarmer]

A person can not save anyone, anything, any other being, other then themselves.

I think it is a very sad commentary on the state of our society that we can, if we choose to do so, allow our pets to die with less suffering and less invasive and uncomfortable care than we force upon our human companions. It's a hard question to answer: "when is enough?" In my personal practice I try to balance quality of life/quality of care of the critters in my charge vs my own. There is a time to cut the cord. It pains me to see needless suffering, of anyone.

I remember watching my mother die of breast cancer. One might just say "fuck cancer, lets find a cure" but that doesn't help those who are suffering right now. Even my mother, for whom I have no love lost, did not deserve that suffering and drawn out death. Drawn out not because she hadn't the means to end it sooner (she did) but because she was afraid to die. Our society so dishonors death that most of us fear it for the sheer stigma. Death is only another transition that our bodies go through. Whether or not one believes in God, or an afterlife, or nothing, the ones who are most pained by death are those of us left beind. Why do we insist on inflicting needless, sometimes excessive, suffering, to spare ourselves a few days or hours before we must grieve. Which we do, for ourselves, for missing our companions, but not for them. They are free of pain, and have no need of our grief.

Comments

[koshmom.livejournal.com]

I agree with your pet vs human euthansia thought. About grieving, I have similar thoughts as yours, mostly grieving is for the living, not for the dead. Many times, after a prolonged illness, I feel very sad for the living caregivers, who now feel a weight from their shoulders, and therefore one large worry which is gone, and they are stuck between sadness that their loved one is gone, yet happiness that they can now get on with their lives without the constant stress of taking care of a dying person. But sometimes I do grieve for the person who has died. This occurs most often because the dead one may have wanted to accomplish something, for example be a part in someone's life. To see their young child grow, to shape their childrens' lives, guide them through good and bad times, to see them emerge as adults in this world. Parents aren't the only ones I grieve for, as many people have hopes and desires unfulfilled when they die, but the parent thing is the easiest example I can come up with right now. The grief is that the dead person won't get to experience many things they were looking forward to experiencing, which is sad.

[quietann.livejournal.com]

My father told me the other day that he is not afraid to die at all. "It's just the next step in the adventure" he said... He does *hope* that there is an afterlife and that my mom will be there waiting for him.

In any case, I agree with you. And it's not just that people are afraid to die, they are afraid to let their loved ones die, too. So often the decision is not in the hands of the dying person anymore.

[lyonesse.livejournal.com]

sometimes one can't save oneself either.

agreed on the human euthanasia issue, though unless the person's not there to do it brainwise, i think i'd still require informed consent / assisted suicide. i gotta decide for the dog; i should not have to do that for another person with their very own mind to make up.

[oneagain.livejournal.com]

Sigh. This is a point of dispute between G and I. Death holds no fear for me, hasn't since I was a teen. There are things in *life* I fear far more than death. Yet I hold on as long as there's strength to do it. G doesn't believe that there is necessarily anything after life. This scares him. The opposite scares me. The thought of rest is welcome.

When I grieve, I grieve for myself. Not by choice. My body takes over with little interference from my mind aside from scheduling it if that option is available. And even if I am sad that another did not get their wishes fulfillled, I recognzie that as a part of *my* grief, as a witness. If I don't want people to die, yes, I might fear the grief coming at a bad time (actually, there is something to be said in my book about putting off the inevitable on occasion) or for feeling abandonment (again, at a time less convenient than others). That's understandable, isn't it?

Then again, one of my "life" goals since I was a child was to have no regrets on my deathbed, and I've done my best to see to this (time will tell if I succeeded). There are those who may have many, many regrets and unresolved issues. The fear of what comes after is more understandable for them. Not a Christian, but I do believe there are those that hell awaits nonetheless. Were I one of them, damn right I'd be scared. With how your mom treated you? And whatever unresolved fear/other issues that motivated this? Her fear is quite understandable to me.

Inflicting needless suffering? Not so much. Any suffering I "inflicted", I would like to think was necessary. Anything beyond that, I would agree with you is pointless and arguably selfish, though please note I'm not necessarily saying selfish is bad. We each have to draw our own conclusions on that front, hopefully with some understanding of balance and karma.

[elusiveat.livejournal.com]

A while back a friend of mine remarked that she doesn't like the way that people talk about "saving a life," since it's more accurate to say "delaying death." Our ethical calculus on many issues would change if we stopped pretending that lives could be saved.

More recently it occurred to me that a more neutral way of saying it might be "prolonging a life."

In any case, it really bugs me that our culture teaches us to unconsciously believe that if we are careful enough we will live forever.